Peterpan wrote:Hi there everyone.I actually quit computer chess.Just had a quick look here since i registered a month or 2 back on this forum.
Hi Norm
I see you compared Ivanhoe 64 bits to Rybka 3 32 bits.
Now if you look closely you will see the ELO difference between Rybka 3 and Ivanhoe in this rating list is only 36 ELO's which is not really much
Secondly,just a general thought.
Hypothetically speaking... (and sorry for also highjacking this thread,by the way i don't drink bear )
If i were to clone Rybka 3 i would...
1.)Be an expert reverse-engineer.
2.)Be a pretty good programmer.
3.)Be able to rewrite many routines to make it look less clone-like
4.)Remove some evaluation functions to speed up program to also remove even more suspicion.
5.)Be an anonymous team of unknown programmers.
6.)Have a grudge against Vasik (mainly jealousy,since he ruled computer chess for nearly 4 years)
7.)Have my main goal of cloning Rybka to point out that Rybka is the actual clone
8.)Be a member or members of the ICGA investigation panel
This is what i would have done.
I am not for any form of cloning or stealing of any code whatsoever.
But i just want to leave this remark and be honest to myself and fair to Vasik and everyone involved in computer chess.
If Vasik did not rewrite Fruit completely and improved it by more than 200 ELO's then there would not be so many strong chess engines out there now.
Do not take away the work Vasik has done for computer chess from him.
If he has used fruit code or similar code (which many of his accusers also does now anyway,by obfuscating the code to make it look original and call it just using ideas) to create a stronger chess engine,and it's not just a matter of tuning values,i do not buy into that... if he has not done that,computer chess programs would be far behind now in ELO and you would see weaker ELO's in the top.
Suppose his engine was reversed-engineered and the ideas he has added is in the open now,then the computer chess world is richer now.Do you shoot someone who feeds you ? even if he has taken the food from someone else?
Lets get over the past,nobody is perfect,lets judge every single engine in the future then with the same critical views as we did Rybka,and be fair.Stop the damn witch hunt.Vasik is a person,a real person,with a family and even if he is guilty of everything he is accused of,he does not deserve to be treated like DIRT.
This is why i quit computer chess,and any activity on any chess forums.
I am not for or against Rybka or any other clone or chess engine or person.
But i am against trying to destroy an individual that has given the world the strongest chess engine for several years.Yes it's not the strongest anymore.Houdini is now,which is also a clone of Ivanhoe i suspect although the first Houdini was an improved Robbolito clone.But Houdart will have to live with this and his conscience and by stating merely that he used ideas is not the truth.So please,all chess programmers,stop the lies,stop the cloning,and start being original.ELO is not everything.Integrity and honesty and looking in the mirror and seeing the person looking back at you is.
If anyone of you can live with yourself and feel happy by destroying someone else,then so be it,but i will not live with myself any further without stating how i feel.
Lastly,i am against any clones or any form of stealing ideas (but within reason and without hatred)
Peterpan signing out,and wishing all chess engine programmers,peace,prosperity,originality and honesty.
A response to same post on Ippolit wiki
Angels_77 Yesterday 10:24 pm
From someone who has both benefited and contributed from and for Ippolit , we find that you leave with such a "bitter post " highly upsetting
we haven't a clue what your on about as regards addressing kranium here as hes not deigned to post anything since his Fire buggy became exTreemly sad
we would however bow to his greater knowledge of cloning as hes had decades of experience at it , and been caught out several times
As regards Vas , in our opinion some have "jumped " on the band wagon and certainly profited by his fall , and yes far to much vitriol
never the less his arrogance and the way he has lied cheated and caused a lot of people financial loss by instigating the blanket bans on playchess is disgusting as is his arrogance in ignoring customers complaints re bishop bug etc . Ippolit had no difficulty in ensuring FREE engines did not suffer this AND strove to ensure ALL bugs were fixed (as did you and other windows compilers ) FOR FREE
Vas just pocketed the money and ignored all bugs and were not talking peanuts here he and Chessbase have sold millions of rybka dvds , aquarium dvds , etc etc BIG MONEY Grand theft auto chess engine
he brought on much of his punishment through sheer arrogance and his treatment of those who bought his products then compounded it with ignoring the ICGA as if dismissing them (his peers ) as irrelevant
he even still beggars belief with statements such as " i ha no idea Fabien had written to them "
Now had he had the humanity and courage to hold his hands up and offer fair compensation and credit to those he stole from and apologize to customers he'd have probably got off with a slapped wrist and a short ban , but he has done neither and laughs as he dismisses all the ICGA and those he has stolen from as irrelevant and even liars and encourages his fanboys to protest his innocence
beyond belief really but his bank mangers probably very pleased
its his reputation that's as DIRT now , he has his cluster and a damn site more profit in financial terms than anyone else in chess so should we feel sorry for him given that his attitude ?
we think not and your leaving is as a victory to him and his fan boys
that's the saddest thing to come out of all this for us Izak
http://ippolit.wikispaces.com/message/v ... 1#40842585